Potassium & Cramping

[Orange]

Will a potassium supplement once a day, maybe during race week, help eliviate cramping (legs)? I've almost got them eliminated, but during the last half mile of Monty Bell, I could feel them coming on.

I stay hydrated well every week. My race-day proceedure is a Hammer Sustained Energy 3 hours before race time. I hydrate well that morning, but not overly so. 8 scoops of Endurolytes in 6 oz. water 30 minutes before race time, shaken. 3 packs of Heed and 8 scoops of Endurolytes comprising 32 oz. of fluid in my CamelBak. (1.5 hour race) I'll do a 5-serving flask of Hammer Gell during the race too. All of this, and I still cramped somewhat at the end of Monty. Granted, a lot of people cramped that day.

I want to experiment with EAS products and First Nutrition as well over the winter. Forgot to metion, I sweat like a stuck pig, so I know I am loosing sodium, etc. thru sweat.

Does anyone else battle cramping? Has anyone else experimented with a potassium supplement?

Sorry for the long post, but I'm getting frustrated because I can't "kick" at the end of a race due to cramping or feeling them coming on.

[twolfcon]

Hey terry,

I've been following your lead on the Hammer products & they seem to be working, although I only ride one lap.
What is your diet leading up to the race?

Mike

[Orange]

I generally eat about 5 or 6 small meals a day. No junk food, no fast food and no alcohol during race week. :frown:

[Hoopty]

Are you starving your body of glucose? I understand the Na/K pump, but it also needs sugar (carbs) for the Na or K to bind to the cell surface for transference into the cell....

[Accumbens]

...and no alcohol during race week. :frown:

I think I found your problem :big_grin: . You should drink Bass - the water used is loaded with electrolytes - that's part of what gives it the rich taste.


Also, he's correct in that sucrose helps with sodium uptake - not so important for potassium though.

[Hoopty]

I think I found your problem :big_grin: . You should drink Bass - the water used is loaded with electrolytes - that's part of what gives it the rich taste.

I did not know that :eek: I learn something new everyday on this board... :big_grin:

[Johnny5]

Too much potassium will cause as much problem as too little, same with sodium. There needs to be a balance of electrolytes. Try sticking to a single source for electrolytes vs trying to create a cocktail. I've had luck with the Elete pills (got them from MOAB, Mark suggested them) this year. Only one per hour vs 3-6 of the enduralytes. (Note: I didn't have issues with enduralytes, but the elete's are less hassle for me while racing)

Another source of cramping is too much food or too much solid food. If your quads are cramping often, it may be that you have too much solid food in your stomache. The stomache pulls water for digestion from your largest muscle group, the quads.

[Orange]

I'm racing on an empty stomach, nothing for 3 hours prior. I generally race around 9AM (Sport). I do a Sustained Energy (Hammer) mix about 5:30 AM.

I'll try the Elete pills this offseason and up my calcium intake during race week before I start fooling around with Potassium. I know Potassium can make you retain fluid.

Thanks for the information!

[kiersta]

Potassium pills should never be taken on an empty stomach. If you use these supplements you should always take them with food.

[Johnny5]

I'm racing on an empty stomach, nothing for 3 hours prior. I generally race around 9AM (Sport). I do a Sustained Energy (Hammer) mix about 5:30 AM.

I'll try the Elete pills this offseason and up my calcium intake during race week before I start fooling around with Potassium. I know Potassium can make you retain fluid.

Thanks for the information!

The elete pills contain a balance of the electrolytes that need replacing. So don't worry about potassium pills.

Also, fruit leather, cliff blocks, etc... have vitamin C, E, potassium, and sodium mixed in for prevention/replacement as well.

Another issue might be that your muscles aren't used to having to clear out the lactic acid levels you achieve while racing. I don't know how you "train" or how hard you push during a race, but you might benefit from some lactic training.

[Orange]

I do some threshold training. Also, the week before race day, I do 90-second uphill sprints at what I think is my V02 max, according to how many days until the race, Monday-6 sprints, Tuesday-5, Wed-4, etc. Gives me 24 hours to recover and doesn't trash the body before race day.

Before the race, I'll do a 10 minute warmup, then hammer some sprints until the thighs burn, on again, off again, for about 10 minutes, then a 10 minute cool down. This is supposed to get the lactic acid build up then clear it out.

I've taken Sport Legs (4) in the past, but haven't in the past several races. I'll take some this weekend at Jailbreak.

[Johnny5]

I've taken Sport Legs (4) in the past, but haven't in the past several races. I'll take some this weekend at Jailbreak.

Sport Legs causes your body to release the buffers that aid in removing Lactic acid. It's kinda like Ibuprophen with lactic buffers and works for many I know who seem to have cramping issues.

[VAmtnbkr]

I found the Hammer website to have some pretty good information regarding nutrition. On the left hand side they have a drop down menu for problem solving - cramps, dehydration, stomach problems, etc. Pick your problem and they will link you to a lot more info.

Obviously there is a little bit of salesman-ship in the articles, but not too bad.

http://www.e-caps.com/

[Orange]

In about a two-hour timeframe, I'm doing a total 18 scoops of Endurolytes (Hammer). I shouldn't have to do that. I'll jump on their site again. I did speak with them on the phone about six weeks ago. They recommended the warm up ride that I mentioned above as well as the 8 scoops in water before I race.

[Robert]

I hope my PM helped a little. Thad is correct. You need a combination when you are racing. On a hot day, I take two endurolytes before I even begin my ride. At Cotton Mill, I felt like I might cramp on the second lap so I stopped and took two more. No cramps. It might have been a little mental but it worked and some people were cramping bad. I also resist the urge to go out too fast. No hole shot for me. Ride your race and stay within yourself. When you push yourself sometimes this will happen. I also feel the long rides really help with your endurance and you should concentrate on building a bigger base this winter. If you are racing for about one hour then your longest ride should be about 2 to 2.5 hours and as aerobic as possible. If you are racing 1.5 to 2 hours, your longest ride should be about 3 to 4 hours. If you are getting ready for an endurance event, then you need to ride as much as Johnny5.:big_grin: The shorter races hurt more and are more intense from the get go but you can still pace yourself. For the longer stuff you have to pace yourself or it may be a long and miserable day.

As usual I probably said too much. Good luck

Robert

[Orange]

Robert, you and J-5 can never say too much! You both are a wealth of information. Tks for the PM Robert. I'll try calcium Friday and especially Saturday morning (with Sustained Energy).

I absolutely love the nutrition/training aspect of racing.

Over the winter, I'll test longer mtb rides at Chickasaw (closest for me) with 3 or more lap segments. Experimenting with different products and/or combinations should eventually resolve the cramping issue in time for next race season.

Thanks again, all, for your valued opinions!

[RedFSR]

I had been having cramping problems and started using Pedialyte the day before and have not had a hint of cramps since. I drink a liter of it the day before.

[Chewieez]

I absolutely love the nutrition/training aspect of racing.


wow, I wonder if you are normal! :big_grin: just kidding Terry!

I hate worrying about food, supplements, what drink I should have. In my perfect world I'd just go out and ride and drink water. Oh and my water would always stay a cool 50 degrees without ice. (I mean it's a perfect world right?!)

I read all these posts and just try to soak it all in. I luckily don't have too much trouble with cramping on most rides. I felt my quads tightening just after each downpedal (while standing and cranking) on my last ride after a medium size road hill after 16 trail miles. I feel like I just need to put in more miles per ride. I need to push my body more for longer so when I ride less and shorter it's easier.

[RedFSR]

....I feel like I just need to put in more miles per ride. I need to push my body more for longer so when I ride less and shorter it's easier.

Greg, I thought the same thing but have been putting in a lot of miles on the road bike this summer. After about 60 miles, I would always start cramping even though I was drinking plenty of water and electrolytes and eating enough. I finally decided to try the Pedialyte thing since I've heard of so many using it and it seems to have been the missing link.

I did a t-shirt ride in the mountains in Johnson City this weekend and my legs felt stronger than ever even though there was more intense climbing than where I train. I felt like I could have ridden strong all day. Time will tell if that was the missing link or just an unusual lucky day.

[Orange]

Interesting about the Pedialyte. I'll add that to my list of things to try this off-season. Thanks for the info!

[Hoopty]

O.K... now I'm curious... could you use Pedialyte for hydration while you ride? I've been experimenting with Gatorade/Accellerade/etc. and I don't like the fructose or extra additives that come with those products, but sometimes it's the lesser of 2 evils... With Pedialyte, I know that you have to consume the product within 48 hours of opening the bottle. From the pricing that I'm seeing online, it looks a lot less expensive than Accellerade but a little more expensive than Gatorade...

[Chewieez]

I've been experimenting with Gatorade/Accellerade/etc. and I don't like the fructose or extra additives that come with those products,

Just a little 411 you might not know about Gatorade:

If you use the powdered mix it doesn't have the high fructose syrup that is in the pre-mixed bottles.

I'm sure there are still better options out there but the Gatorade powder is pretty cheap. (~$4-5)

[Hoopty]

Just a little 411 you might not know about Gatorade:

If you use the powdered mix it doesn't have the high fructose syrup that is in the pre-mixed bottles.

I'm sure there are still better options out there but the Gatorade powder is pretty cheap. (~$4-5)

Thanks... yeah I've been curious about that. I need to check the backside ingredients.. I can't remember if it has crystalline fructose (which when you add water - you get syrup) or not.

[Orange]

Someone at Acme Multisports (Triathlon Store in Goodlettsville) told me about ZMA - Zinc, Magnesium Asparate. You can get it at GNC. The guy said everone he tells about it never cramps again. Can't wait to put it to a test!