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Thread: Trainning Tips

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    Trainning Tips

    I've been riding for a few years and am looking to do this race just wondering if anyone had any tips on trainning. Last year I had riding time around 4 to 5 hours at Raccoon MT. Don't know what to expect and any tips would be greatly appreciated.

    I plan on doing the 12 hour solo
    Thanks

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    Uzzi is offline You have ticks on you because you didn't weed eat the trail
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    Not an expert, but have some recent experience.

    Well let me tell you this-

    Certainly not an expert but I have recently rode a 6 hour race solo. 6 hours is an incredible amount of time - 12 is even crazier. When I was finished with the race, I couldn't imagine doing another 6. I do know that it was the most fun I've had on a bike. What better excuse to ride your bike all day then to do an endurance race? In retrospect, I would have done more road riding, trying to get up to 100 miles regularly just to train my body to be on a bike that long.

    I thought I was well enough hydrated, but started to feel nauseated just past the half-way point. I know that some endurance riders like Pua do an all liquid diet. I noticed things went south after I ate a banana. Normally a banana would seem like a good thing to eat. After that, I couldn't get any water down and at the end I was pedaling with one leg just to get back to the parking lot. Nutrition is a very personal thing, and what works for me doesn't work for say Full Squishy who basically eats Bar-B-Q before ever rides and seems to do okay.


    I did see a bunch of choads shoot out of the gate like it was an XC race. They lasted about 2 -3 laps and put their bikes up and went to grab a Red Bull and see the masseuse.

    However, there are some real experienced endurance racers on here and I'm sure they'll have some great tips and info.

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    Here are a few links with some training schedules that may be useful. I road last year with a five man team at DSG (here for the beer) and got in two laps for the team. My first was muddy and my second was in the dark. I must say if I had 12hrs on my own I would needs a new body and/or much more training. I have trained and completed many marathon/1/2 marathons and DSG was more challenging than any of them. That being said, I can't wait to do it again!

    Anyone who can hammer on that trail for 12hrs get major props

    here are the links

    (5month schedule) http://www.24mtb.com/?p=32

    (3mnth schedule) http://www.24mtb.com/?p=31
    Taylor Fife
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    I second the suggestion above about riding on the road. You need to do a few 100 mile rides to get use to the time in the saddle. Nutrition is the biggest key. Everyone is different and you can't go by what someone else does. You have to figure that one ou for yourself BEFORE race day. Getting in the calories and staying hydrated will be important.

    Plan on riding for 12 hours and hurting and then hurting even more. Unless you train all the time your body is not going to be use to what it will be experiencing. You will find out at your first 12 hour how mentally tough you really are.

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    AS said many people here do it way more than me but let me chime in on food..

    Before I did any I experimented with different foods on 6+ hour MTB rides and 100+ mile road rides the nutrition needed is much different than your typical ride my goal was to know prior to the races to know what I could eat and what works - no need to experiment at the race.

    For me I do a rotating bottle - one that is a supplement and one of water - I make sure I drink one bottle every hour, and I also ate solid food every other lap or about every 2 hours give or take (once again i knew the foods to take) for the solid food I did things that I could grab and ride with like rolled meat and cheese or a PBJ...

    Hope that helps.. but try some stuff out you will be surprised what you find will upset your stomach on a long ride..
    C


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    Thanks everyone,

    I was thinking of doing a few trainning days at chickasaw just because it'll be easy to set out a cooler on the back of truck and get used to riding, eating and staying hydrated. Any suggestions on a good drink mix?

    Thanks again

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    Top Secret

    You will get a different perspective from everyone you ask, but your own experiences will teach you what works or doesn’t work. There are no secrets to completing a 12 Hour. The only way to find out what works, for you, is by gaining experience by riding your bike. Get in some long rides, some short rides, some easy rides, and some hard rides. Sometimes the easy ride is the hard ride, because you think you should be going harder! Vary the intensity of your rides, do some flat rides and some hilly rides. Logging hours and varying your rides will teach you and your body how to react when you get into unfamiliar territory…..and also keep it fun. If you are not reaching unfamiliar territory on an occasional ride, you probably need to vary your rides some more!

    If you are committed to doing DSG, then the rest is easy. You have plenty of time to prepare, or as I like to call it…..ride. Ride your bike whenever you get a chance. If you were planning on riding today but something came up and you only have 45 minutes to ride, get suited up and ride your bike for those minutes. If you don’t have time to get to the trail then go ride on the road for the amount of time you can squeeze in. If something else came up and you have to miss a day or a couple of days…..don’t get upset b/c this will affect your motivation to get back out and ride. Roll with the punches and stay positive…..there is “no whining in mountain biking”. The more time in the saddle you gain by May 2nd, the better you will feel on May 9th….and 10th, and 11th, etc. I personally love to ride my bike for fun, so I don’t follow a “training plan”. I just ride my bikes at all different intensities and different distances with all different people.

    If you don’t feel like riding your bike on a certain day, you might want to think about whether you are committed or not, or maybe you just need the day off……..you are the only one who can answer this question too.

    You will also learn what type of Nutrition works for you. Maybe you want to try to liquid diet, maybe you like to eat solid food, the only one that knows this is you……..whether you know it right now or not? Getting out and riding will answer this question. If you try a liquid diet on your rides and it doesn’t upset your stomach, you feel good, and are having fun, then stick with it…….if you like it. If you like to eat bars, gels, hamburgers, and some Snickerdoodle cookies on rides, and you feel good and don’t have stomach issues……you may want to stick with it b/c it’s working. Eat and drink what works and don’t try new things on Race Day out of nervousness…….it may not work!

    The week before DSG you may even want to reward yourself with an easy week on the bike. Take a couple of days off and get yourself rested for the upcoming weekend.

    On Game Day: Have fun and ride your own race…….don’t get caught up with the folks flying by you, but take note and see how long it takes them to pass you again! Each time the same rider passes you, whether it’s for the second, third, or possibly fourth time (at DSG,) you are that much closer to the finish. If you had varied your rides, the intensities, and entered the unfamiliar territory prior to the race a few times, you will completely know how to befriend the demons that will enter your head while circling the track for those 12 Hours. This should be a reunion with the demons, not the first time you meet them!

    When you finish, enjoy the emotions you feel………my experience tells me that this is an AMAZING time! Enjoy yourself and those around you, then share your experiences with anyone willing to listen.

    On May 10th you might feel tired, sore, maybe mentally confused! Get back out on your bike and start your recovery…..this is very important and will get you feeling like yourself again…… go spin around for an hour (this is where the demons are the worst for me). The more riding you are able to do before DSG the faster you will recover and the more you will enjoy the experience.

    Have Fun!


    Keith

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paddlechris View Post
    but try some stuff out you will be surprised what you find will upset your stomach on a long ride..
    C
    So true.. on my first ever solo at Stanky last year, towards the end, I got to where i couldn't even eat a gel (which was a flavor & brand i had been using & had used in past w/no ill effects, so was a known "good") w/out feeling sick.

    the best advice i got that day was, "Remember, it's a long day. Set your pace accordingly if you want to ride until the end". ( Jeff)

    Lots of good advice here though, at least in the opinion of a newbie to the things.

    Rick

    PS. Don't have big plans for the day after either. Was much rougher than having been 1/2 of a two man team.
    "I'm so poor, I can't even pay attention!" - unnamed NASCAR fan in Martinsville, VA

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    Don't think about just eating... remember math class

    Think about calories. Your body can only process so many calories per hour at effort. If you are stuffing a gel, a powerbar, and cheeseburger while washing it down with a bottle of energy drink every hour, chances are you will soon become nauseated, unable to eat or drink, and start feeling all manners of ill. This is what happens when your gastrointestinal system decides you're making it work to hard and it gives up on you.

    So remember, if you are drinking a bottle of energy drink an hour and it has 240 calories in it, and you also slam a 210 calorie cliff bar every hour, you may not think that is "eating a lot" but it's close to max calorie intake per hour.

    The other mistake I often see/hear about is people gorging themselves with food the night/morning of a race. Carbo-preloading doesn't work that way, you need to be on a nutritional plan for a while before the body can take advantage of that style carbo-loading. Just eat a normal breakfast and dinner and your body will perform much better for you.

    As everyone else has stated, everyone is different and processes different foods differently. Personally I've never been able to do the all liquid diet and I'm often seen eating pizza and cheeseburgers in 200+ mile races.

    Most importantly, remember we are doing this for fun. Keep it fun and the rest will fall into place.

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    I believe the key word is "fun".
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    Caloric balance and hydration really are the keys--provided you get enough physical training.

    I learned to eat last year. Now I make it a point to eat/drink on even most short rides. You CANNOT replace your fluid or calories 100% on the bike, but you don't want to get too far behind either. The window of "just enough" is what you've got to learn in your training. Eating nearly every time I ride helps my body learn to divert enough energy to my digestive system, yet keep the legs working. That's the fine line.

    While I'm much better at eating/drinking on the bike, I did get gastro-distress after my 6th hour at Dahlonega last year. I'm still not sure if it was over or under eating-I just had to stop all ingestion and catalog that pain with all the rest.

    Best of luck. I'm trying it solo this year too-but with a much better training program. I may post up some "enduro" training rides (trail and road) as I'll definitely be doing a few of those this year.

    SLEEP!!!

    I 'bout forgot. One of my worst enemies at DSG last year was that I got there late Friday night and only got 2-3 hours crappy sleep in those stormy conditions. Camping is fun, but have your rig sorted out before heading down to Lincoln county.

    PACE

    Amateur solo riders are going to get passed a lot by team members and by professionals. Let 'em go. Ride your pace...wait until the 8th hour to start chasing riders down-if ever.

    My goal is six laps. Maybe more, maybe less-depends on training and race-day conditions.

    COURSE

    As I recall, there are no real recovery zones in the woods--and it's all woods except for the fields. I'm taking the fields serious as recovery zones this time. If you get a chance to pre-ride the course, take it. But then after three or four race laps, you'll kinda be familiar with it.

    Last edited by WadePatton; 01-27-2009 at 01:33 PM.
    All days are good, some are even better. -Hank (cyclist)

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    And stay away from the Prichards Double Barrel Bourbon and Sweet Lucy that will be flowing the night or two before the race. It won't help your lap times.

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    Quote Originally Posted by meanjoe View Post
    And stay away from the Prichards Double Barrel Bourbon and Sweet Lucy that will be flowing the night or two before the race. It won't help your lap times.
    It will if you are only planning on riding two laps like me!

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    Don't make drastic changes in your diet

    Thad is correct. Your body can only process about 350 calories per hour. Your body is working hard to ride and digest what you are consuming. Personally, I use a mix of perpeteum and gatorade with endurolyte powder. I also use GU. I have ridden for 8 hours with no solid food intake and not bonked. I do eat a good breakfast that has about 1000 calories in it before a long ride. I know that I can eat Waffles or Peanut Butter or bananas, drink coffee and Slimfast about 2hours before a ride. Sometimes I have waffles and eggs, sometimes peanut butter/jelly on toast or bagels. You have to find out what works for you and stick with it and practice using it in your training.

    KRS said to have fun as have most on this board. I have never been out on any ride that I did not have fun even if there was some suffering. Love to ride your bike and do not become a slave to your training schedule, if you have one. If you want to ride 2 hours and can only squeeze in an hour ride one hour. If you cannot get to a trail, ride on the road. My feeling is that you need to do some of your road riding on your mountain bike. You need to feel that weight, that rolling resistance as much as possible, in my opinion. I do not own a road bike. I do ride about 50 to 60% of my time on the road. When I started riding more on the road, I got in more time, more miles, and it helped my mountain biking a lot. Have fun and stay healthy.

    Robert

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    Although I have only 3 endurance races under my belt, each was a different experience. Race 1 was Dirty Spokes in GA - awesome in all aspects. Luckily, it was overcast and 65 degrees all day. I ate PB&J's between laps, drank the OS stuff (which I personally like and have had no bad experiences with) and HEED. I also ate dried dates, figs, and raisins and cashews - I also think I drank apple juice (made for some killer retrorockets while riding). I ended with 36 miles - more than double my previous record for a day.

    My second 12 hr at LBL with Diesel ended after 2 laps. The second lap was going great - 1 mile left on the lap I started cramping in my legs. Unbelievable pain. The last 1/2 mile took me 20 minutes - not fun. The difference - it was humid and around 95 degrees. And I did not drink or eat enough.

    My third was DSG - I did 2 laps and ran out of time. I could have done more and should have. I waited for my start until the trail dried out (around 11 or so) - good decision in my mind to this date. I ate and drank more than previously.

    This year, who knows???

    Just remember, we're out there burning between 500 and 1000 calories an hr - if you ride 6 hrs, that's between 3000 and 6000 calories, plus the normal 2000 per day - like someone said - do the math. Calories in --->calories out.

    Steve
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    I don't know anything about endurance races. But I've done a lot of stupid long, stupid hard rides.

    Rest: The week before is waaaay too late to try to make up for lost time training. Taker easy.

    Fuel: Wheat is a crappy fuel item. I eat Peanut Butter sandwiches day of, but I'd never eat a plate of pasta the night before a race. Quinoa is pretty much the best stuff ever, mostly protein. Mix it 60/40 with brown rice, eat that, a pork chop and some greens and you'll be good to go. In the morning I do fried rice/quinoa mixture (leftover from the night before) with a couple/few scrambled eggs, maybe some spinach. Tons of Coffee (and a half gallon of water). I do gels and heed and all that stuff during the ride/race, but I focus on eating "clean" whole foods the week and especially the few days before an epic.

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    BEER!
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    Quote Originally Posted by meanjoe View Post
    And stay away from the... Sweet Lucy
    Sorry, but that's impossible.... that stuff is SOOOOOOO good!
    Greg Lawrence
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chewieez View Post
    Sorry, but that's impossible.... that stuff is SOOOOOOO good!
    It's too good. Goes down like it was 40 proof. But I'm pretty sure it's 80. It doesn't come back up so smooth.

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  32. #20
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    just to put in my 2 cents, (and get back into chatting on the forum) I like Accelerade, I use it for long rides, and I've used it for soccer and weight training. when we did 3 a days in preseason, it totally rocked. I was never sore, I kept up my energy levels, concentration, and I completely outlasted all my teammates. It was def my saving grace!!! now that I'm done with college soccer (graduated) I really want to get into racing on my bike. so cheers for the 3 and 5 month training guide! I wanna do a couple centuries on my road bike, and hopefully one on my mtb, along with a couple cross country races.
    Chesca


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    Quote Originally Posted by meanjoe View Post
    And stay away from the Prichards Double Barrel Bourbon and Sweet Lucy that will be flowing the night or two before the race. It won't help your lap times.
    It wasn't the Prichards or the Sweet Lucy. I think it was the amount you consumned
    Did you hear the one about the guy on his death bed that said "I wish I would have worked more and rode my bike less". Said NO ONE EVER. -Jeff Scott

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    http://www.hammernutrition.com/downl...gn=fuelingbook
    Here is some good reading on endurance nutrition. These are the principles and guidlines I follow for enudrance racing and training. Easy and intersting reading. 140 pages or so. I would copy this info. Read it and keep it for future reference. I love their products. But I keep it simple. I only use HEED, Sustained Energy,Hammer Gel and Endurolytes.

    My best advise for anyone who is trying to get better or improve at anything. It being mountain biking or tidly-winks. Seek out and ride with people who are just a little better than you are. You will become better and learn a lot from these people. Because they too ride with people who are just a little better than them. And they can teach you what they know about training and racing. They will push you harder than you can training by yourself. This also makes your training a lot more fun. There are a lot good and fun people in this area in the biking community. Befriend everyone. Everyone has somthing to offer you.

    Endurance racing is lot different from XC racing. XC racing is more about speed, power and efficency. My take on edurance racing and training is this: It's about how much you can "endure" before quiteing. AKA pain threshold. To me endurance racing is just different levels of pain. Stay within the level of pain that you can endure. Of course, you will be forced out of this zone from time to time.That's good. But limit your time in the "Red" zone. I myself don't need a HR monitor (beep..beep..) or a power meter to tell me when I've Red Lined. I d@mn well know what this feels like. Get to know it during training. Don't be afaird of this feeling. This is what a XC race or a good group ride feels like. This effort is what fatigues you during an endurance race. You can not keep up that pace all day. Only for hours.

    I think you need to try to get in at least one (1) maybe two(2) long rides a week for the next few months. I mean at least several hours. Even two days or more in a row if possible. And start doing some hill rides and group rides every chance you get. If you really love biking this will not be a chore. You will want to be on your bike every chance you get. Know your fitness and don't try to take on too much too soon.

    And always remember. Your're doing this for fun. Not trying to make a living.
    Last edited by Dook of Moots; 01-30-2009 at 10:04 AM.
    Did you hear the one about the guy on his death bed that said "I wish I would have worked more and rode my bike less". Said NO ONE EVER. -Jeff Scott

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  36. #23
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    This is some of the things I've seen from the previous 2 years.

    Tinker had fruit, gels, something to drink, and a Blimpie sandwich.
    Jost Toastada - drink and gels only
    DJ and Fuzzy - chips, white powder donuts, and anything you could imagine
    Thad - Beer

    Everyone's different when it comes to food.

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